Marco Bassani on The Italian Crisis

A Conversation  with Prof. Marco Bassani of the University of Milan.

TJF:  Prof. Bassani, over the weekend Italian voters decisively rejected a set of “reforms" proposed by PM Renzi.  It is hard for Americans to understand the significance of the vote, particularly since very few of us follow Italian politics.  To begin with, could you please describe Renzi’s proposals.

 MB:  Quite frankly I believe that even most Italians had only a vague idea of the proposed constitutional reforms. They voted from their political guts and clearly rejected  Matteo Renzi’s Constitution. 

The package was a very complex transformation that revolved around the change from a bicameral system to a loosely unicameral one (the Senate did not disappear, but was transformed into a less political assembly).  The Italian parliamentary system is in fact a quasi-perfect bicameralismthe Senate and the Chamber of Deputies are both elected by the people and have exactly the same competences. 

The reformers did not have the courage to suppress the Senate: They envisioned a very complicated second assembly reduced in number, and composed of regional representatives and mayors.  The confidence vote for the Government would be the prerogative only of the Chamber of Deputies.  

There were several other features of the reform, from the diminished role of the Regions to the restructuring of the referendum process, from the annihilation of the Provinces (administrative units, similar to the American counties) to that of CNEL, a quite useless corporative body with representatives of the employers and employees that is a very minor legacy of fascism. At any rate, the average voter would have had to spend about 60 hours just to understand what all this was about.        

The real matter of the reform was, however, a law that is not part of the Constitution, that is the electoral law called Italicum (these laws usually have Latin nicknames in Italian politics). The old  party system (1948-1992) was predicated on the cold war division, and it was based on a very bizarre struggle. It was a political fight between one party, the Christian Democrats, that could not be overthrown from power, and another one, the Communist party, that could not really get power.      The end of the cold war and the various scandals destroyed (or rather forced a general reorganization) of all major parties, and  electoral laws were passed with the intent to build a two party political system. This proved to be impossible: the Italian electorate seems to have a clear vocation for proportional representation.   

The political system is now made of three or four distinct political groups, one of which the Five Star Movement (M5S) is probably equal to Renzi’s Democratic Party (more than 30%) but will never agree to form a coalition government with any other party. The chances of having a political stalemate of the sort that Spain had for one year, or Belgium for almost two, are great.  

TJF  Any political agenda has both an exoteric and an esoteric side.  Publicly, how did Renzi present his plan, and what do you think his real objectives were?

MB: The whole referendum must be seen as a power struggle between Renzi and the old guard of his own party, the (post)communist executives that were never really ousted by the young mayor of Florence.  Renzi was Prime Minister for about one thousand days.  While he never even tried to tackle Italy’s economic problems, i.e., national debt, amazing public expenditure (56% of GDP), and the heaviest fiscal burden on earth, he bet everything on this referendum.  He depicted it as a way to reduce the heavy cost of politics, to shorten the legislative process, to simplify the working of government.  It was rather a reform that was intended to give much more power to the Prime Minister.

TJF   To some extent, when he first put forward his reforms, Renzi was counting on his own popularity pulling them through.  What happened to his charisma?  Does it have anything to do with the migrant crisis which hits Italy worse than most countries?  Are the stories true of the Italian government taking over hotels and unused houses against the wishes of the owners?

MB Some months ago he felt so confident that he started this reform battle against the whole political spectrum.  To be honest he was able to get twice almost 60% of the votes in Parliament, as the process of constitutional amendment requires.  But he broke a non-aggression pact with Silvio Berlusconi when he decided to go ahead and elect the Italian President, Sergio Mattarella, without consulting the old leader.  I still believe that it is quite remarkable that he got 40% of the votes playing this match alone against the rest of the world.    


The migration crisis is clearly the main source of his loss of popularity. Immigration policy is a total mess. While 
the economic recession is the worst since unification in 1861, anti-immigrant sentiment is at an all-time high. The government sends the Navy to rescue anyone leaving from North Africa to Sicily by boat, then brings the migrants into camps. While only 2% eventually (after 19 months of red tape) get the status of refugee, no one is ever expelled. Italy went from a physiological 2% of foreign born population to almost 10% in less than 25 years. Meanwhile to say that property rights are not respected by government officials trying to accommodate the needs of hundreds of thousands of immigrants would be an understatement.     

TJF  Last year, while we were spending a month in Rome, we went to Florence for a few days and visited a jewelry shop near the Duomo.  The proprietress urged me to leave Rome and spend more time in Florence, and I made some quip about doing the opposite of what Renzi, the former mayor of Florence,  had done.  She proceeded to lecture me, as elderly Italian ladies like to do, and expressed considerable contempt for the Italian Obama.  A good friend of hers had served with Renzi on the city council and pronounced him the stupidest politician he had ever met—a pretty large claim.  What do you think?  To me, an American who has tried to keep up with Italian affairs, the lady in Florence seemed absolutely correct.
MB Renzi found some dignity in defeat last night, when he resigned and conceded somewhat gracefully. He is a  shrewd politician, that has his best moments in the fight.  Some years ago, at 39, Matteo Renzi was the youngest European Prime Minister. He is called Teo by his friends, but he has no real friends, only political connections.  He posed his entire life as the youngster opposing a party apparatus made by obsolete caryatids. 

In a country that is on the verge of a demographic crisis, and aging rapidly toward an astounding ratio of one to one (that is, for everyone in the workforce there will be one pensioner), Matteo seemed to embody the optimism of youth. For many years he was called “Rottamatore” (the Scrapper) as his single political agenda was to get rid of the old guard of party leaders. Renzi is a sort of Jack Weinberg, the guy who invented the slogan of the Sixties: “Don't trust anyone over 30.” Problem is, as time goes by, now he is over 40. 

I would not consider him stupid, that is the I.Q. is not his main problem – my guess is that he would be somewhere between Obama and HRC but he is in bed with the oldest politician there is.  Behind the image of the young non apparatus guy who became Prime minister there lurks the oldest - in every sense of the word--European politician, the former President Giorgio Napolitano, his real mentor.  Born in 1925, a major figure of the Italian Communist party, Napolitano in 1956 publicly defended the Soviet invasion of Hungary.  Napolitano and Renzi are a very odd couple, but the mayor of Florence the politician who put the last nail in the coffin of the Italian communist elite – owes everything to the old communist leader. 

TJF  Obviously, Renzi has to resign.  What are the immediate consequences?  In particular, how will his departure affect the Banking crisis? It seems a bit ironic that the Monte dei Paschi Bank of Siena, once praised by Ezra Pound as being the first honest bank, is going under with a burden of scandal and corruption.

MB Renzi will resign. In a few weeks there will be a new Prime Minister and elections will probably follow in the spring. There are at least 8 banks that should simply fail, but will cost the taxpayers an immense amount of money. This vote will probably simplify the issue. Renzi, in fact, never confronted the banking system's spectacular failure as he was too busy trying to convince the people that the Italian chaos was actually caused by these two chambers having the exact same competences.  From 1472 to the era of Ezra Pound, the banks were not managed directly by politicians, in the past 70 years Monte dei Paschi of Siena was the private bank of the Communist Party. 

TJF  Finally, many observers are comparing this election with the BREXIT vote in Britain.  Although the EU was not really on the ballot, does this rejection of Renzi “and all his works” have implications for Italian membership in the EU?

MB There are two crises that most likely will trigger the downfall of the E U. The national debt and the unstoppable invasion of non-European migrants. Italy has 25% of the grand total of the euro zone debt and is the absolute assembly center of the North African influx.  The European ultimate crisis will start in Italy, and during an election. However it will not be this one–we are still in the realm of politics as usual –but most probably the next general election, in which the ultra-statist 5 star movement will win. M5S, born out of anti-establishment feelings, is now advocating even more government spending, from minimum income guarantees to bank and firm subsidies all across the board. If they actually win it would be the final blow for what is left of the Italian economy.

Marco Bassani

Marco Bassani

10 Responses

  1. Robert Reavis says:

    Andrie Navrozov has suggested this refugee crises is encouraged and accelerated by enemies of the West. According to the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees, the top three nationalities of entrants of the over one million Mediterranean Sea arrivals between January 2015 and March 2016 were Syrian (46.7%), Afghan (20.9%) and Iraqi (9.4%). Almost all Moslem.

    Of the unauthorized entrants arriving in Europe by sea in 2015, 58% were adult males over 18 years of age, 17% were adult females over 18 years of age, and 25% were minor males and minor females under 18 years of age.

    My question is how has all this tough talk from our war hawks in the American foreign policy establishment concerning The Middle East and Afghanistan, benefited us or our allies in Europe ? Why are folks like James Webb or Andrew Bacevich who predicted this outcome years ago not even being mentioned by the folks considering Romney as our top diplomat?

  2. Avatar photo Thomas Fleming says:

    There is no need to seek foreign enemies to blame for the “refugee” crisis, when Hollande, Merkel, and Obama gleefully betrayed their countries. It is simply too easy to attack the evil Russians, when we could have stopped this any day of the week. Indeed, blaming others is a serious distraction from the real evil, which is the suicide of the postChristian West.

  3. Bagby says:

    As soon as I began to read about Renzi’s loss, I searched to find out if Dr. Bassani had written anything about it. Thank you so much for the interview! I love learning about foreign politics, although the news from Italy is so dismal.

    I have a question for the good doctor, or anyone who has wisdom. Italy’s debt situation is clearly unsustainable. The Five Star Movement does not seem any more financially responsible than the establishment parties. What should Italians do? Clearly, too many Italians are relying on the state for support. Should Italians voluntarily reduce their standards of living to stem off an uncontrollable collapse? Should they reduce consumption in the cities and adopt agrarian policies in the country? I am no ideologue, but I am very curious about a constructive way forward out of such a mess.

    Dr. Bassani says that the migrant crisis is unstoppable. He may be correct, but I still desire clarification. No border control system is perfect, but it seems anything is better than the current policy, which looks like an open invitation. Depositing the migrants back on the shores of Africa seems like a good start, and would certainly dishearten those who are contemplating the trip in the first place.

    I am most interested in a vision of how to deal with a state seemingly destined to collapse under debt. Long distance trade is likely to end in such a situation. How might a family or community or town protect itself? My own small city, thankfully, is surrounded by what used to be farmland, and is an unlikely target for plunderers. I can imagine a difficult survival through agriculture and the small-manufacturing that built my city and, to some degree in the case of manufacturing, still sustains it. We still have plenty of country folk all around us who I am relying to have to know-how to restore agriculture to some degree. We have a small meat-processing plant. We have community-supported-agriculture start-ups. I think these are practical things to consider. What do you think? Should Americans also voluntarily reduce consumption, invest in large gardens, support local agriculture, and buy solar panels? I am reminded of Carter’s famous “Malaise” speech.

  4. Robert Reavis says:

    “The European ultimate crisis will start in Italy, and during an election. However it will not be this one–we are still in the realm of politics as usual –but most probably the next general election,”

    I always appreciate a man who can see two or three moves ahead. Aristotle remarked that recognizing causes is one of the marks of intelligence. One can see it in the most obscure and most obvious places and times, in games like Chess, writing music like Mozart, in life and death struggles like the difference between tactics and strategy, or even in obtuse pleasures like reading The Diaries of Lewis and Clark. Going back and reviewing the pros and c0ns of the original Iraq invasion under Bush is another example. Some men could see past the end of their noses while most could not. Some leaders are visionary statesmen, most are not, some Generals real commanders, while most are trained soldiers, some gifted by grace become saints, most remain ordinary sinners. Like suicide and postChristian, which both end in death and share the same purpose only by different paths, it would seem like our world is indeed composed of both wide and narrow paths. I enjoyed Marco Bassani’s comments and insights.

  5. Dot says:

    Merkel betrayed the EU by letting Turkey become a member. Europe is on her way to becoming Islamized. It will be just a matter of time before it happens and the Muslims are patient. France is an example.

    The post Christian era of which we are in has produced a vacuum or void which will be filled. It will be filled by those of stronger convictions than Christianity which has been weakened by a materialistic desires. However, I think the church has to look within to examine her role in this change and ask why is this happening. The church is supposed to be like a spiritual hospital. But how much is the church addressing the spiritual needs of her members. Sometimes I think she is more focused outward on what the members owe the other instead of each person’s soul reaching to God.

  6. Robert Reavis says:

    Dot,
    The EU betrayed itself from the beginning by refusing to acknowledge its roots and adopting political falsehoods as foundational to its existence. Again, it offered sacrifice on the altars of economics, not culture, not tradition, certainly not the sound theology of its ancient heritage so perhaps it is simply no longer economical to maintain.

  7. Dot says:

    Robert,
    In my view, there was no betrayal. If there was, it was due to desire to emulate the US by forming a union of countries. They wanted to become like the USA. Each country then, was reduced to a state. Poorer countries became poorer because they depended upon the largesse of the Union. Portugal and Greece, or some areas of Greece, are an example.

    A recent example is western Ukraine. They wanted to join the EU probably because it was an impoverished country compared to the eastern section of Ukraine that was more industrious. Greece at an earlier time became a member. I saw the western Ukraine as wanting the same benefits as what Greece was enjoying. The US, like a hydra, chimes in and agrees with eastern Ukraine to join the EU.

    The EU could never acknowledge any roots because, by becoming united by countries, they were forming new roots as united countries. Like you wrote, the culture of each country was sacrificed for the sake of economics. I guess I’m saying the same thing but I don’t call it betrayal because each country was in agreement when it was formed. If there was any betrayal, the people of each country were betrayed.

  8. Dot says:

    Robert,
    In the second paragraph, last sentence, I should have written western Ukraine.

  9. Dot says:

    Robert,
    Scratch all the western Ukraine. It was eastern Ukraine, the part of Ukraine closest to the western part of the EU. East, West! I need to stay away from politics.

  10. Robert Reavis says:

    Dot,
    Yes, I understood your point. Good to hear from you.